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Open Board / bisexual potential
« Last post by jimmymac on September 26, 2014, 09:11:47 PM »would you say that most men are to some degree bisexual?
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Der Eigene (Blog + Video) / 0051: So we can all just turn straight by force of will?
« Last post by andkon on September 20, 2014, 11:53:16 AM »http://www.justusboys.com/forum/threads/427383-Are-ONLY-women-fluid-with-their-sexuality?p=9646056&viewfull=1#post9646056
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I wrote a free book specifically on the sexual fluidity of males. In ancient Greece and Rome (but elsewhere too), men had sex with other men. Not 3% of men, not 5%, but a much larger number. They weren't merely tolerant of the few people who were same-sex oriented but the culture itself was oriented in that manner. No polls are available, but we know that of the first twenty Roman emperors, eighteen (or 90%) were reported to have had sex with other men. Other cultures around the world reported similar experiences between men. So what happened that 95% of men would say they're exclusively heterosexual now? Christianity. Same-sex was forbidden starting in the 300's and almost everyone is raised to feel that same-sex sex is gross or for just effeminate men.
Think of how uncomfortable most men are wearing speedos at least here in America. Well, in Europe when I was growing up, everyone was wearing them so no big deal. Sexuality is just like speedos: It's just social pressure and expectations. Innate sexual orientation, my ass.
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Right, so we can all just turn straight by force of will?
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Not necessarily.
My book is mostly about how most straight men cannot have been born straight. This has to be the case if we see that in the ancient world, most men it would appear had no(ne of our*) qualms about same-sex sex. Genes/hormones/whatever do not change in a few centuries. Culture can and did. That culture "makes" people straight does not mean that straight men can by force of will change their sexual habits. It does mean that for "straight" men who are already open-minded or curious, informing them that they're not really born straight could perhaps lead to a greater incidence same-sex sex.
Where does that leave the gays or homosexuality? Well, the problem is that there is no one thing called homosexuality. If you just browse the table of contents of Homosexualities by Stephen O. Murray, you'll see that there have been multiple types of homosexualities, plural. In some cultures, you had relationships between men of same rank or males of a different, both masculine though. In North America, you had berdaches who were feminine men used like women; the top in this relationship wasn't considered different from other males. Under the modern nomenclature, all of these people would be considered "homosexual" now. So... can some of these people change? Well, maybe.
I've never understood how some gay men can have sex with dozens or hundreds of men of varying quality, yet if a vagina is attached, "Eww, no thanks." Really, that's the deal breaker? A lot of gay men are effeminate and end up with other effeminate gay men... but if there's a vagina attached, "Eww, no thanks." Those in stable relationships (gay and straight): would you ditch your partner if they magically sprouted genitalia contrary to their biological sex all the sudden? So how much of homosexual exclusivity is due to the hetero-majority's bigotry that segregates gays, for example?
*There were sexual taboos in Rome. A freeman being penetrated was looked down upon, although no doubt many did it.
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Open Board / Re: UK diver Tom Daley
« Last post by Johan on August 09, 2014, 10:14:30 AM »In the Q/A forum, anyone can start a thread but only I and the original poster can respond. Feel free to start a new thread here on Ian Thorpe, or ask me below in this thread.
That's such a waste!
I was going to add the link to his full interview with Michael Parkinson.
In it, he does go on to say that he IS gay.
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Open Board / Re: UK diver Tom Daley
« Last post by andkon on August 08, 2014, 04:47:03 PM »andkon, I wish I could talk to you about this one on one.
Oh!
I CAN'T post in that Ian Thorpe thread! The reply button isn't there! Why is that?
In the Q/A forum, anyone can start a thread but only I and the original poster can respond. Feel free to start a new thread here on Ian Thorpe, or ask me below in this thread.
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Open Board / Re: You’re Not Straight. You’re Not Gay. You’re Not Bisexual Either.
« Last post by Johan on August 08, 2014, 04:27:29 AM »In my experience, everyone is straight until the lights go out :-)
Huh?! What about those who are gay?
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Open Board / Re: UK diver Tom Daley
« Last post by Johan on August 08, 2014, 04:22:17 AM »andkon, I wish I could talk to you about this one on one.
Oh!
I CAN'T post in that Ian Thorpe thread! The reply button isn't there! Why is that?
Oh!
I CAN'T post in that Ian Thorpe thread! The reply button isn't there! Why is that?
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Open Board / Re: UK diver Tom Daley
« Last post by andkon on August 07, 2014, 12:02:52 PM »Johan, that idea was very well defended in the book. That was its point - that "grero" is a slap in the face of all that people want to believe. "I'm gay" is individual; grero is global
Yes, gay tells us about the individual. Grero is to look at least to the past and say, "This many people cannot possibly be exclusively heterosexual now."
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Open Board / Re: Ian Thorpe
« Last post by andkon on August 07, 2014, 12:01:28 PM »Either he's gay and not comfortable with it or he's not gay but not straight either. The current system does not allow for much nuance, so it'll be interesting to check back on him in a few months or years.
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Open Board / Re: Why the society do not accept greros - threat of promiscuity
« Last post by Johan on July 28, 2014, 04:08:00 AM »Perhaps the heterosexual nuclear family is the myth and homosexuality/grero is the reality. That's what you just admitted.
Care to introduce yourself, Siya?